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A Good Beginner DSLR? Help
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Hi ALL,
First off I want to introduce my self to the forum.
Im Steve, I live in Carndonagh, Co. Donegal and a total beginner to photography.I had a few friends visit me from the UK this year and all brought huge impressive looking DSLR’s
that create some of the most stunning photos I have ever seen!.The area I live is very rural with loads of fantastic landscape shots & wildlife to capture.
Not only the great views I would also like to take shots of my kids etc…I have been saving my money for a while now and reading loads of books & web pages with regards what camera to buy.
Im currently suffering from information overload.
Most web pages & books keep contradicting each other.I have a budget of about 800 to 850 Euros (1000 Pounds Sterling) and have been looking at the local Jessops store in Londonderry (Derry)
they seem to have what looks like a good deal with a Canon 450D & 2 lens kit (Canon EOS 450D + 18-55mm and 75-300mm Lenses) for about 549 Pounds.I thought this would be a good starter as I would be able to afford a few other items im told are required like bags,SD card & tripod.
Can anyone shed a little light on what would be a good starter or have I picked out a good starter already.
I have been told over & over “that its better to buy a cheaper camera but put my money into glass”Any help would be great!
many thanks
Steve
Hi Steve and welcome to the site, I think the hardest thing about all this photography lark
is picking your first camera, I like you deliberated long and hard and scoured the photography
mags in the hope that a light would come on and I would KNOW without a doubt what I should
buy :)Well it didnt…………so I chose a Sony purely because my Dad had a plethora of Minolta lenses,
I was not disapointed with my choice but soon I wanted the newer model, my point being camera
bodies are almost disposable with the amount of “new” models the manufacturers bring out yearly.Lenses stay with you forever (if they are any good :) ) I stayed with Sony as it gives me everything
I could ever need and loads that I dont :) The most important thing is to be comfortable with it,
the camera has to feel right in your hand so that means going into the camera shops and holding the
cameras, do they feel right? are they too heavy? are they too light? are the buttons and dials easy
to get at? There are many entry level slr’s all very competively priced so just get out there and try
them.Best of luck with your choice and look forward to hearing what you decided on.
Hi Steve,
The kit you have picked out is fine – and will allow you to capture great images.
I’d recommend going a little ‘up’ on the camera for now as i’ve had a 450D for a year. Forget the 75-300mm zoom lens for now.
Jessops do the EOS 500D and a 18-55mm for £569 (with a £30 cashback).
It is a 30% maybe better camera than a 450D ( better sensor & more pixels, HD movie mode, higher IOS (for low light), a better processor and LCD).
Later when you have become familiar with the technology – you can then start a ‘Lens’ Collection.
The 55-250mm gets better reviews as a ‘Zoom’ and is only £169 if required – but you can get that later if you wish.
Stick with the kit lens – and it will be fine for the moment for landscapes and as a ‘walk-about’ lens.
http://www.camerapricebuster.co.uk/prod596.htmlthe 50mm f/1.8 is an awesome little lens at approx £90 – and should be first on your list for next lens purchase.
I’m sure Jessops will throw in a SD card – and maybe a spare battery – otherwise these are available very cheap on eBay. Chinese eBay batteries are very cheap and work fine.
A set of Cokin P grad filters will also serve you well for landscape images. Start with the 121M graduated grey, the 67mm ring adapter and holder. All about £35
Best of luck,
Bren
Hi Steve. Welcome to the site.
Everyone will have different opinions on what is best for a beginner. I started out with a 450D not too long ago, but have moved on to other models since then. The 450D is a great little camera & is very easy to use, but may be a little small & light.
I’d recommend going into your local camera shop & look at a few different models from different camera makers that are within your budget. Pick up & try them all out to see which feels best in your hands. Whichever is the most comfortable to use will be the best for you. Try not to exceed your budget. Good luckHi, what you´ve been told is 100% right; lens is much more important than body.
As a Canon user I have to tell you that their basic kit lenses (18-55 and similar) suck, moreover it´s almost impossible to sell them later.
The next thing you should know that your calculations are wrong; €1000 is £830, not vice versa. So if you have €850 it means you have only £700, not £1000. And if you have £1000 it means you have €1200.
Now the good news:
I know a French landscape photographer named Vincent Favre; you can check his website here: http://www.cristaldegivre.com/” onclick=”window.open(this.href);return false;
Some of his photos have been taken with Canon 400D which can be bought for £200 so you can spend most of your money on lens; now it depends if you have £1000 or £700. If you have £1000 (it means that after purchasing the camera body you´ll have £800 left), I recommend this:
Lens: Canon 17-40 f/4 L -£ 530
Tripod legs: Manfrotto 190XPROB – £110
Tripod head: Manfrotto 494RC2 – £50
Filter: B+W Schneider MRC 77mm circular polarizer: £70TOTAL: £960
And if you have only £700… try to find another £260, this gear is definitely worth the money :D
PS: This goes even over the £1000 budget but I also recommend a ND grad and also a full ND filter, in certain situations they can help you a lot. If you want a budget friendly option, choose Cokin, if you want the best quality, choose Lee or Singh Ray.
EDIT:
This was taken with €1000 Canon 5D:
This was taken with €250 Canon 400D:
Do you see any difference? Both photographs have been taken by the same photographer with the same lens.
brendancullen wrote:
Later when you have become familiar with the technology – you can then start a ‘Lens’ Collection.
No offense but if you are not retarded you must get familiar with a new camera within a week. When I visited Photo Fest Ireland 2 months ago I grabbed a €14,000 Hasselblad, asked the owner where to set aperture and exposure, how to focus and where is the shutter button and I could start shooting right away without even reading the manual.
you must get familiar with a new camera within a week.
I’m quite sure i’m not retarded, nor would most novices be.
If i was a betting man – i’d bet the €14,000 camera wasn’t your first one.
bren
Hi Steve and welcome along to the mad house
I’m not far from you just out the road in Gleneely and a few guys on here are from Malin,Carn,Buncrana and Moville.
I’m a nikon man myself but to be honest it is really down to what feels right for you
I work in Malin town if your about during the day if you want to have a fiddle and play about with a D200 a few years old now but will give you a feel for nikon camerasI am also a member of foyle camera club which meets in Derry on wednesday evenings and the guys and gals there will let you have a wee play with there cameras canon,nikon etc etc
Let me know
Cathal
brendancullen wrote:
you must get familiar with a new camera within a week.
I’m quite sure i’m not retarded, nor would most novices be.
If i was a betting man – i’d bet the €14,000 camera wasn’t your first one.
bren
It was “my” (I only wish it was mine) first medium format, moreover with brand new focus system (it was the new H4D with the “True Focus” technology) so I can compare my situation to someone who decides to transfer from point and shoot to DSLR.
But back to DSLRs; if you buy a Canon 400D, you´ll get familiar with it in let´s say 4 days. If you buy a Canon 1D Mark IV, you´ll get familiar with it in 6 days. Are these two extra days worth the difference? Definitely yes.
Btw this has reference only to camera bodies, I can´t imagine how 18-55 f/4.5-5.6 can be more simple than 17-40 f/4 L, so there´s no logical reason why to buy cheaper lens first.PS: If you want to know, my first photo gear (camera, lenses, filters, etc.) was about €2000, I bought it in January 2008 and I still use it. And with my computer there was exactly the same situation; I spent about €2500 on it but the last upgrade was done in spring 2008 and since then I haven´t spent a single cent on it and it still does everything I need including the newest games. In other words: “I´m not rich enough to buy cheap things” :wink:
Hi ALL,
First off many thanks for the warm welcome you ALL seem to have fun with your photography!
Sorry for the late reply – The electric here supplied by ESB has been on & off all day and had blown up the power supply on my main computer & my laptop so using the wifes. (I feel a claim going into the ESB!)
Thanks to ALL who posted comments its all being taken on board!
ok lets start to answer some questions-I think i got mixed up with the budget so lets clear that one up – I have 1000 euros to play with or 830-850 pounds sterling.
MMX:
ok on all the equipment on the list
My un-trained eye could not tell the difference with the photos you posted I can only assume that the “printed” quality would be better or larger?
I think even starting with the stock lenses would be a help me as I only have a basic point & click at the moment so would help we descover what types of photography I would like to do… if that makes sense.Cathal:
Many thanks for the reply – I would love to take you up on your offer and have a look at the Nikon setup.
All the reading in the world is not going to help if I don’t get “exposure” (excuse the pun) to the cameras and feel them in my hand to see what is comfortable.Im only down the road in Churchtown, near to the Carndonagh Cross so would be handy to meet up.
Nice to see there are people up here near me from the Foyle club!.
I emailed the secretary Peter yesterday about calling up to the club but I think you were on an outing to Malin Head or the Pier?
Im meeting up with a local friend of the family on Friday there son is about 15 / 16 years old and dead keen – He has a nice Fuji digital and does some fantastic work with it – so I hope there will be 2 new members for the club soon if all goes to planThanks again – need to send this now as the power has just gone off again and the UPS has just kicked in on this pc
catch you all again & thanksSteve
just another quick point –
Where is the best places to shop for cameras?Online & walk in shops
I know only of Jessops in DerrySteve
The best thing about Jessops is that you can go in and have a feel of the camera
then when you see one you like have a shop around on line
don’t rule out the second hand market either as some great bargins can be had
Anyhow I will pm you my no if your about you can have a go with my set-upCathal
carnsteve wrote:
My un-trained eye could not tell the difference with the photos you posted I can only assume that the “printed” quality would be better or larger?
Neither can my trained eye while looking at €500 AS-IPS LCD screen. And prints would look the same, 5D has 12MP sensor, 400D has 10MP sensor; this makes only 20% difference (compare this to 400% difference in prices). In other words, it was the lens (in this case 70-200 f/4 L, £550 on amazon.co.uk) and filter which made the photos look like that, not the camera body.
carnsteve wrote:
I think even starting with the stock lenses would be a help me as I only have a basic point & click at the moment so would help we descover what types of photography I would like to do… if that makes sense.
No it doesn´t. Even the new 5D Mark II has full auto mode so it can be used as a “point and shoot” camera. Moreover you already said you wanted to shoot landscapes and wild animals; did you change your mind?
One more thing to illustrate the difference between lens and body:
I recommended you the 17-40 f/4 L. This lens has been introduced in 2003 and since then it hasn´t been upgraded and it´s not likely to be upgraded in next months or maybe even years.
In 2003 Canon also introduced a camera; it´s name was 300D. Since then it has been replaced with 350D, 400D, 450D, 500D and this year with the newest 550D. This means that this lens outlived five camera bodies and will probably outlive the sixth one too.
So ask yourself; will you rather pay £500 for something that will hold it´s value for 7 years (and probably even more) or will you pay £500 for something that is going to become obsolete in 6-9 months?I know that many newbies are afraid of “pro” gear, but trust me, working with 17-40 L is no more difficult than working with 18-55, while the difference in image quality is huge. You don´t have much money so don´t waste it on bells and whistles but spend it responsibly and justify the extra costs only when the result will make a difference.
MMX many thanks for the advise,
I need to go have a look at a few and see what I like that is within my budget.
when I started saving about 3 months ago I was looking to get the Canon EOS 1000 but having read the reviews from people, they were not very happy with it and quickly traded up to the 450 or 500.I think that i will go for the Canon 500 after i have had a play but one thing that is sitting at the back of mind is why are all the pro’s using Nikon?
ALL the photo’s in the latest mags all taken with the Nikon’s.
I need to have a play with them and see what im comfortable with within my budget.As for what shots I want to take – no nothing has changed i still wish to take wildlife & landscape shots
Thanks again for the help
And dont you lot SLEEP??? replies at 12 and 1 am!!!!! blimey i was tucked up in bed at 10pm reading my Digital Photography mag! :)steve
ALL the photo’s in the latest mags all taken with the Nikon’s.
Hi – this is untrue. Have a look at all the “White lens” behind each goal at the World Cup. Mostly Canon’s for sure.
But – I’m not getting into a ‘which is better’ debate.
My opinion is that they are as good as each other. One model overtakes the competitors similar priced model at a given time – then the reverse. The EOS 7D is now king of the APS-C sensor range. No question on this. Nikon will probably overtake it at Xmas.
Go what what ‘feels’ good. The availability of lenses is equal.
http://www.differencebetween.net/object/gadgets-object/difference-between-canon-and-nikon/
I have a Canon – my pal has a Nikon – and we’re both very happy.
ciao
bren
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